i will read later, but who is that man who wrote false things, yes we have to defend, and we now all pray against them and inshallh god will revenge for us. so what ?
that is the normal thing and we have to rocket them as they rocket us. they are the aggressors. they yes love life and we love death, if we were enforced to it and paradize is for us and hell is for them as they kill innocent kids, womens and children and steal our souls. God is just and any aggressor will enter hell and that is known in all relegions, so what u expect.
God(Allah) protect our people in Gaza and only he will be our shelter not UN, not arabs, not any people in this world as it prooves they are usueless, only there are some ordinary people which their souls are with us , but cant do anything to change the equation.
i told u even whom dislike hamas , now they change their minds and like it and that is the reaction to what we see daily of photos of kids. also today one kid in hospital is about to die, which his mother and she lost 2 daughters and doctor tell her that he will follow his sisters, so she is beside him in al shifa hospital.
every scene we see, we curse israel and who support it. curse to them ameen for their crimes for humanity as long they know they will kill innocent people and they even didnt apply any UN resolution of giving us even border to 1967 . Israel hates peace and prefer war as they have much weapons to agress , but dont have any actual basis for peace as she knows she is aggressor country so she choose to continue that as weapons give her more power.
by peace all realistic facts will condemn israel as all UN resoulutions are against it, can u understand? so by theift she took more than by peace and she continue that by the help of US administration.

see mike and all, iam whom always was neutral and dont like anyone to be killed, after i saw those increadible my innocnet people to die, so i pray to God as they also will taste the death as we saw it. also i pray for their kids to taste the bitter as our parents taste. so what is new?

they start to kill us, so we have to react and the whole blame is the one who start and God knows that and he will sooner or later punish them and yes let them taste the same as they let us taste on, so dont try to show the people of israel now innocnet, now they are encouraging and electing the most government which kill more of our kids, so of course we will pray to God to let them also killed as they are targiting us innocent hamas and all their relatives and kids and in quran it is like that just.
so how come u justify that becasue of rubissh misseles of hamas hited to israel and justify that they kill all of palestinians, they are liers they want to kill all palestinians and let us not defend, becasue we are the witnees to their cruilty and we are the voice of just and as long as any palestinian is alive they will not feel peace even if only one palestinian kid alive , god will let them afraid all their lives. that is the just of God also.
also they killed doctors in al shefa hospita. if u see our media and newspapers all are with hamas, and all condemn israel , US and britain as also they let UN not giving any thing good for cease fire.
englishman dont tell me that u goverment is also a just one for us at least the first guilt is from britan which give a promise to those cruel men to steal our land.
shame on u israel, US administration and Britain administration.

that girl knows and all knows that rockets which kill her family is rockets made in US and the hands of cruel soldiers israeli killed her family even they have families at home. it is clear unless the world is crazy and he has no mind . really strange to speak like that.

never i know that some people lye to theri selves untill they believe that they are not lyers.

and the girl knows also that hamas rockets those in retilation for the blockage of gaza and for prisoning all popoulations of palestinie in gaza and retilation for no food, no electricity, for demolishing homes, it is also a revenge from israel.
she knows that perfectly and all arabs and muslims know that rockets of hamas is to tell them to open the blockages wich kill also innocent palestinians and it is legitame and it is a must even sorry they didnt kill and only a revenge and we are not animals to be rocketed and keep silent , those are real men and not cowers like israeli soldiers who even afraid to face to face even a palestinian kid holding even rockets as they feel shame of themselves for stealing land wich is not belong to them

i dont search much in net . but u can go to aljazeera and read all posts even bbc in arabic, they did many pollos and all of them blame israel of that. the majority of muslims and arabs blame israel and u dont read news and how many demonstrations all blame israel.
my broblem i dont use computer to search, and have not much knowledge , iam lay person like millions watch tv and read newspaper and angry for the cruilty of israel and as refugee , i will not accept any solution without returning to my homeland and i like any one to defend my right and the rights of all refugee to return and i think that is the reason for killing hamas people as they want refugee to return back. really i want to read about hitler and why he killed jews? really why? can u tell me? even if he is wrong, why he think they deserve such that? i dont know ? i have no time to read or think, it is enough what is going on in palestine, as if he knows they will occupy and kill innocent people ? i dont know , i dont defend hetler, but really i dont know. can u tell me pls.

No, it is you who manipulated HER sayings. She is a child mourning the loss of her family, not motivated by politics. It is in the depths of her pain that she speaks the truth that you would like to deny. That without Hamas, her family would still be alive. I can understand why you do not want to face that fact. It is devastating to admit your complicity with Hamas resulted in innocent deaths. But while truth is not easy, it is still the truth.

did u read comments on that girl ? all are against and blame israel,and also as i know the channel of al quds is with hamas or alagsa , so i think it is from fath as even i didnt hear the voice of the announcer what he is asking the girl at the end.

but u can read all comments on that video to know the real truth mr mike.

you didnt answer about the demonstrations aroung the world blaming israel and not hams. are u a normal person?u cant see or read, go and read what links and i told u to see demonstrations and majority are against israel and blame them and only u and owly say the reverse
really unbeleivable and u r responsible for u beleve and Allah will take care of u and with all aggressors. life is very very short and it is better to live short life with strong faith and morals and go to paradize than living long life with very bad supoort to aggression and lies and then die and enter hell for crimes done in their lives.

"...you didnt answer about the demonstrations aroung the world blaming israel and not hams."

What is there to answer? A few demonstrations does not reflect world opinion. All that proves is there are no shortage of terrorist sympathizers for a demonstration.

Fortunately for me, I do not believe in your Allah and the God I worship does not tolerate terrorism in His name. I believe Arafat is doing his happy dance in hell, along with the recent Hamas arrivals.

iam proud to be a muslim , thanks God he chooses us to be muslims and go to paradize.
mr owly if really u know international law, why first israel occupy us and why she is till now against international law.
iam not thirsty to any blood and israeli and others are shediing the blood, u know now how many innocent people killed 430 and 2272 till now.

inshallh all now of martyees are at paradize and just now i finish from a speech by nasrallah about day of judjment and how people will be punished or rewarded according to theri acts in life and also how groups also will be punished and that day which we will send to paradize or hell and inshallh criminals will go their to hell and those of hamas in paradize and u r not God to decide who will be their. be humble or u will cry blood at the day of judjment as u encourage the killing of innocent people by supporting the act of israel and not defendint the innocent people
be what ever u be and choose what ever u relegion. we will not be questioned infront of Allah about u relegion , as you will be alone in the dark hole when u will die and u will not any help from any organization or even from u children or any relative and only what will help u is u good deeds and not be with the aggressor .
again thanks God iam muslim and mike nobody tell u to beleive , it is u business and u will be bare u responsibility when u die. we have nothing to do . it is up to u. choose what u want and that is. no body will tell u to change as no use . somepeople even if they are not beleivers , they are more just and sense and may be before they die, God will guide them to the right truth as long they are humble and not rude and use their logic and sense and dont kill anyone or start killing them.

u and mike are thirsty of blood as u wishes for us a nice war.
you know that israel are now killing innocnet ones and u wish us that blood.
never i encourage killing , but what iam now see and all of us, really i want God to revenge and that is just.
instead of telling israel to withdraw and give us our land , u encourage them. really unbelievable.

it seems u relegion now christianity encourage such aggression. yes like Bush who said crucify. it seems the pure old christianity changed to blood shedding as of course u change it by having 4 books different of bible.
ok , that is the reason for all those wars. go back to u pure christianity which say about our prophet and which prohibit stealing our land .

I posted a piece a couple of days ago (God knows where as I can't find it !!) which gave a different perspective on Hamas. In the interests of balance here is something quite different.

http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/3194846/groundhog-day-for-the-fifth-column-of-malice.thtml

It is not because it is from the right wing that it makes it wrong, it is just because it is wrong. I hope that my rant came over with a degree of humour as, I find her views so off the wall that I cannot take her very seriously. But some thought Stalin amusing at times too :-) You know my views on the effects of tribalism and, although I have jewish friends who do not support Israel's government actions, there are those that certainly do and, possibly worse, there are those who I know would not agree but cannot bring themselves to say so. So yes, I think that the fact that she is jewish does affect what she says and how she thinks, though it would be better if it did not. As I said, this does not disqualify her from having an opinion, but may explain why she may not be viewing the situation wholly dispassionately and without bias. I disagree with what she believes and think I made a case against what she said.

David Aaronovitch is more of my political hew which I suppose is why you gave the URL for his article. And, as you might expect, I agree with most of what he says. I think the answer to one of his points, about why we rail at Israel but not so much at specific violent acts elsewhere, is that we expect more from a country that is, in many ways like our own. I also think we do complain about acts of violence, like the stoning to death of young girls or the funding of suicide missions. What planet has David been on if he does not see the (over)reaction to suicide bomb threats. But what reaction would there have been in Britain if the British forces had attacked Eire for harbouring IRA terrorists, because they did so and had a good deal of support from the local populace. It may have taken 40 years, and maybe it is not wholly settled, but it is in a whole lot better state than Israel-Palestine situation. I know it is not the same, but there are many parallels in the way Sinn Fein argued with the Ballot box whilst having various unofficial IRA groups with armalites.

also now palestinians family going from home to home to hide, they told them they will explode this home beside them, so they went to other relative to stay, and then also they got another alarm , so they are refugee now in gaza also, from home to home
is that humanity? they want them to hate hamas, is that a clean war? first stealers and all eyes of the world watch that interisting film and stay silent laughing and dancing and now killed innoncent and buildings demolish over the people and anmimals. today a big horse was under buildings with killed palestinians? where are bregete bardo for e.g when she accused muslims of killing cheep for eed?
let her and see not our humanbeings , but at least to see how many animals now are burried under the palestinaisn own homes.? really shame

I suggest you read the article in today's Daily Telegraph. Perhaps more graphically than most it shows why the Palestinians are fools lead by idiots.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/barackobama/4077213/Even-Obama-cant-solve-the-Middle-East-problem---and-hed-be-foolish-to-try.html

owly
sorry to say, u r the fool , and not the palestiniasns or most of arabs and moslims in the world.
we are lead all by the idiot of bush and israel and by the bias media which are not honest at all.
see the first time i will reveal where i live even i said in the gulf, yes all my life i lived in my beloved country which is kuwait. since my father was a refugee , then he came to kuwait when i was 5 years old with all my family. kuwait is the only country i live in since 5 years till now. so u can say beside my love to palestine, i love so much this country and especially today.
you know why also today i love her much and much, today i went withe an announcement in newspaper for a demonstration to support gaza and of course that is the least thing i have to do for gaza and palestine.
i went with my neice who is 10 years old . now the news interupt me as now the cruel power which is israel hit a mosque and kids are killed in the mosque and 10 others. really horrible scene. who is cruel and fool and idiot? those are the criminal ones. i hate them.
i will continue now mr englishman , and for mike who said there are no demonstration in the world. i will speak about which i attend today and i witness. for some time i think that palestinian issue is been forgotten here , but i was wrong. really iam proud that iam living in kuwait, as majority of those people support also hamas, you know one of the man in parlement say that he will remove his (ekal) means ( the black cloth usually gulf people put on their head) as a respect for the martyees in Gaza and for hamas leader and his shoes for Abbas, and all arab satellites broad it before.
most of kuwaiti and others nationalities went to this demonstration i think there were thousands of people even it was cold weather, and even e.g one of the family go and that doesnt mean others are not support whom still at home.
some of demonstration said kuwait and Gaza together in unity and dignity.
all of what was said was a support for hamas, and encourage to support hamas and not to be defeted and against israel. really iam proud of those people and i know they have the sense of truth and i told u all lay persons are with hamas, even those people , said all we are hamas, and all are with her. i told u even whom dont like her before, now they know the true colour of israel and support hamas as they want to revenge for the killing of their brothers,.
now that is enough, really till now they damaged 10 mosques with civilians . all people in the demonstrations was angry and the official and popular people are angry and want to save lifes of palestinians.
i know that happen in all the world, in jordan, iraq, denemark. london, newyork, indenosia, afganistan, pakistan, germany, and many other countries, even eypt , syria, iran and others and all blame israel and not the victom.
wake up owly and mike and say at least an honest word for u selves only. u will not change this world but we r all responsible in front of God about our speech and how we think. it is honesty.

Abdulksaida,

Did you read the article in today's Daily Telegraph ? One doubts it. Pity really because you would have learnt that the West (President Clinton) tried very hard to bring peace to the Middle East, but Arafat would not agree. He could have had almost everything he wanted and yet he could not agree.

Arafat was an idiot, a liar, a thief and (in all probability) a murderer. He lead the Palestinian people nowhere. And I'm sorry to say I do not believe that you have any interest in making peace with Israel. It is all hate, hate and yet more hate, added to the delight in being a victim.

Iron Mike has made a very valid point in his posts. Hamas fired rockets into Israel, so you have no right to complain when Israel strikes back. If you were a good Muslim you would condemn what Hamas has done, but you don't and wont because it suits your purposes for there to be war and suffering. You are lucky, living in Kuwait and being freed by Western force of Arms from the tyranny of Saddam Hussain.

now as they start ground attack they killed 5 with kids.
Allah is with us inchallh and the evil is with them
that what i can say.

owly when israel did genin masacre did hamas launch any rockets.
they want to destroy us only and gain time. i hate that u beleive them so u r one of them becasue of that dont say u r anymore arab. you dont have our feelings and i dont beleive u r like us.
arabs have dignity, they cant accept occupatioin , they fight the enemy who steal their land since 60 years'
i cant live even in palace given by the stealer side and forget my home even if it is a tent in my homeland wich i born there and my parents died before they smell its air. they died while they were frustrated and angry. they only want to visit it but forbidden. never never i will forget that in all my lifes. i always remember with all refugee the strugle.
of course u dont care. u parents didnt born in palestine and know the history. u parents were not refugee. your parents dont suffer like millions of palestinians tell now suffer from the aggression of israel. they are liers who dont want to withdraw. Gaza still is occupied and it is a big lie to say they withdraw. shame on all with israel and shame on all with the evil, as u choose to be with them.

Some solid polling that supports US solidarity with Israel in the current conflict. Poll: 12-31-08

http://www.rasmussenreports.com

Fifty-five percent (55%) of adults, however, believe the Palestinians are to blame for the current situation in Gaza, while 13% point the finger at the Israelis. Nearly one-third (32%) aren’t sure.

Men are far more sympathetic to the Israelis than women. Fifty-six percent (56%) of men support Israel’s military action, compared to 34% of women. Sixty-two percent (62%) of men say the Palestinians are to blame versus 48% of women.

Sixty-seven percent (67%) of those who say they are following news out of Gaza Very Closely support Israel's military action, while 30% favor diplomacy.

Seventy-three percent (73%) of Republicans blame the Palestinians, as opposed to 47% of Democrats.

always us support israel , so it is not new . especially hamas are muslims and try to apply sharia and of course by bias media they show them as the same as al qaeda and terror organisation and sorry to say most americans lay persons are ingnorant and not educated and interisting about others in the world as i told u.

all the blame is on u western media and islamphobia only.
so also now my sister asked me if i see the man whom all his family died as 7 members. they asked him what he will say and appeal to whom? he replied that he will not apple to any one and will not ask any one or part in this world, only he said he will complain to God only. really those people are increadible in their faith, i hope i have strong faith like them. they are extraordinary humanbeings, really i admire them, when my beloved husband died , i cant bare , i suffer much till now, but those people are really increadible in thier faith and say that God will revenge from israel. still they know that God will revenge for them. i like to learn from them really. you dont know how much those people get respected from all arabs and muslims. they are our idols and belovers, those martyees are highly admired , they are our idols and most respected people.

mike and owly

read this article from OD on gaza

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/guest_contributors/article5420584.ece

really it described well the situation.
it seems still there are honest men in this universe which are western , i was wrong before, but i think they are rare .

owly
the whole world didnt give hamas any choise or chance even to practice the democratic elction and to show their people how they are much caring.

since there election , borders of Gaza closed, put them in seize, now israeli enter to palestinians TV and propagte false things about hamas and threaten palestinians to be with hamas.

now womens from all over the world calling lay palestinians in their homes and talk to them and try to know information from them about hamas to kill them later.
the world launch a dirty and injust war against hamas which no one wants to give her even a test . really shamful and injust. so to whom u think we will go to complain?
do u think we have to complain to US? what she did, she support the aggressor more.

do u think we have to go to UN? we went, so what she did? they didnt implement any force to israel to let them accept or apply any resolution because of the support of US

do u think we will go to criminal court? we went, what happend, nothing
do u think in 60 years palestinians didnt do anything
really enough is enough, that is the dirtiest war launched in the world against hamas and the people of Gaza.
so after all so we will only go to God( Allah) , at least he will not reject our prayers, even if he didnt answer them right away, but for sure inshllah it will be answered.

so that is our last resort , no other one after that long suffer. do u agree?

"do u think we have to complain to US? what she did, she support the aggressor more.

do u think we will go to criminal court? we went, what happend, nothing"

Nothing is done because you don't have a case! Please explain why Arafat rejected the Oslo accords which offered a REAL roadmap for peace? You've had multiple chances for real peace and have rejected them all because for you, it is all or nothing. Either Israel goes, or no peace. Sorry, but the world has spoken and they said, "That's not acceptable." So you can sulk and wonder why no one comes to your aid and enjoy the situation your beloved Hamas has created.

mike

you wrote "We are also more objective in our understanding that lasting peace comes from peaceful negotiation, not 6,000 rockets."

so also we are more realistic and objectives and we dont now belive after killing 560 innocent palestinians and 2290 injured will establish these 2 peacful countries. so 6000 rockets if they rocketed to palestinians and didnt kill only 4 peple so may be peace will come. i dont know how u think, and you think u r right.

now more and more hate is created already from the aggresson of israel, and i dont think it will quickly healed. by longing the occupation which israel can withdwaw and only implement UN resolution so 2 states can come. I told the whole world and i swear that israel is also afraid of 2 peacful states. all of us arabs and muslims knows that. still the west is beliving israel, but one day they will be shocked more and more from the terror act of that stolen country.

This is a different perspective. The article was flagged by OD. Here is the link -:

http://www.independent.ie/lifestyle/why-the-israeli-people-have-finally-had-enough-1592022.html

mike
nothing was offered to arafat to be accepted. tell me did they agree refugee to return back?

why u dont answer me ? did they give him that or now we are no longer palestinians to ask for our homeland and homeland of our grandfathers and grandmothers and for many generations we lived there before u or others jews from all over the world come and steal our own country

can u tell me, did clinton agree that refugee can return back or not?
please answer that

never u tell me what they give arafat to accept. nothing

Me thinks things are going to get s little more heated, news agencies are reporting that the Israelis just struck a UN school in Gaza killing at least 40 people. Even Drudge has it running on its banner, apparently the visual carnage is extreme.

I wonder if Mike and Owly will continue being so cavalier about the innocent being killed.